Just a question (archived by Speed')

[Mimus]

No need to get a big fight going now guys.

As i read it between the lines change ddnt mean to be rude. He might be a bit emotional and his wording/phrasing wasnt the best, but after all we shouldnt get poked by capslock and exclamation marks, right

Lets just look at the core of the things posted, the content, rather than the way it was phrased (im sure change can and will improve it and get more calm in the future, mb he just had a bad day).

1. We do indeed have a suggestions, especially a map suggestions thread in TJ for the purpose of what is posted here. Ofc TJ forum can use more activity, but we shouldnt let it become a habit to open a new thread for everything considering that in the future, when the TJ forum is more active, there will be plenty new threads and its good to collect some topics in one place, like the map suggestions in the map-sugg thread.
Both of you have a point. Atm its np to post things in main forum, but later it might be better to post them in the specific threads.

2. Noob maps vs. hard maps. There is no need to differentiate as a whole between. As change and others mentioned, we can add some "greyzone" maps which include easier and harder jumps. Also, we can add both, easy and hard maps and then let people vote for it. WHich leads me to the next point:

3. Voting hard/easy maps. Pretty easy and self-explanatory, if there are more new people they will surely vote for the easy maps, and if there are more pros they will vote the hard maps. Either way from one side some people might leave, but that happens. On ND people leave because they dislike goldrush instead of battery, on sniper people leave when ocean comes on whereas other (me, lolol) mainly come for this one map. Thats just how things are, but:

4. Whats more important, members, clanless guests or clan-guests? Hard question tbh, but can be answered. Our members always come first, because we keep paying these servers for YOU in order to have fun. However, you have all once been guests, and moreover there is hardly any fun in gaming, even in TJ, if the server is empty.
So the members come first, but what the members should want is to do sth that makes guests visit the server. So anything a member suggests should (and will probably) increase the amount of guests.
Now about clanless and inclan guests: Both are important. The thing is, clanless guests are likely to become members, whereas inclan guests like eT, HU etc. will probably not leave their own clan in order to join TWC. On the other hand, a lot of clanless guests are clanless because they dont even want to join any clan, or because they dont play regularily (and also will not play actively on our server ofc.)
After all, both are equally important - new guests and clanguests.

In the end, if we have an equal amount of nooby and pro maps in the server, whatever map is voted some people might leave.
But that doesnt mean the leave forever. The keyword is, as usual, communication:
If a new map is voted, e.g. a pro map, and there are a lot of new players who dont want to play that map, tell them that after this map there will be an easy one. Or tell them hey, lets all gather sunday around lunchtime and jump together so you can learn trickjumping (i guess i should attend those lessons too )
Vice versa, if a noobmap is voted and pros want to leave - they will come back for sure. Especially if you tell them that a pro-map will come later.

And if after all that you still are not okay, we could ofc also try to find a "rule" for it. Example: Whenever a map with a certain level of difficulty is voted, the next map has to be another difficulty. (Like, a noob map is voted --> next map is a pro map).
However, that would mean we have to classify all the maps in hard/easy and also find a way to prevent people from just voting another easy/hard map again after one map ends.

Mimus

[The Master]

most tj maps last forever so the mapcycle doesnt really work here:P
and to make rules for it mimus, well thats not really an option i think, cause when you play alone or with 2/3 poeple with same skills they mostly jump along together and if a hard maps get on no1 can make it and they have to wait for example 500min xD:P
but even if poeple r thinking about it its more bad to have a to hard map you cant jump then have an easy map, because then you can atleast jump it.
i think if gammamill gets on the server everyone is happy, even me cause i like that map:P

[rAkon]

Nice words mimus, master

Just remember everyone you play a game to have fun and good times, Pro ore not you gotta accept both.
Like me, i joined Sniper but i'm not the best for sure xD, i just liked the member and other stuff within and had fun all around the clan.
So here we are.

Keep up the peace Greetz

[Strax]

No need to get a big fight going now guys.

As i read it between the lines change ddnt mean to be rude. He might be a bit emotional and his wording/phrasing wasnt the best, but after all we shouldnt get poked by capslock and exclamation marks, right

Lets just look at the core of the things posted, the content, rather than the way it was phrased (im sure change can and will improve it and get more calm in the future, mb he just had a bad day).

1. We do indeed have a suggestions, especially a map suggestions thread in TJ for the purpose of what is posted here. Ofc TJ forum can use more activity, but we shouldnt let it become a habit to open a new thread for everything considering that in the future, when the TJ forum is more active, there will be plenty new threads and its good to collect some topics in one place, like the map suggestions in the map-sugg thread.
Both of you have a point. Atm its np to post things in main forum, but later it might be better to post them in the specific threads.

2. Noob maps vs. hard maps. There is no need to differentiate as a whole between. As change and others mentioned, we can add some "greyzone" maps which include easier and harder jumps. Also, we can add both, easy and hard maps and then let people vote for it. WHich leads me to the next point:

3. Voting hard/easy maps. Pretty easy and self-explanatory, if there are more new people they will surely vote for the easy maps, and if there are more pros they will vote the hard maps. Either way from one side some people might leave, but that happens. On ND people leave because they dislike goldrush instead of battery, on sniper people leave when ocean comes on whereas other (me, lolol) mainly come for this one map. Thats just how things are, but:

4. Whats more important, members, clanless guests or clan-guests? Hard question tbh, but can be answered. Our members always come first, because we keep paying these servers for YOU in order to have fun. However, you have all once been guests, and moreover there is hardly any fun in gaming, even in TJ, if the server is empty.
So the members come first, but what the members should want is to do sth that makes guests visit the server. So anything a member suggests should (and will probably) increase the amount of guests.
Now about clanless and inclan guests: Both are important. The thing is, clanless guests are likely to become members, whereas inclan guests like eT, HU etc. will probably not leave their own clan in order to join TWC. On the other hand, a lot of clanless guests are clanless because they dont even want to join any clan, or because they dont play regularily (and also will not play actively on our server ofc.)
After all, both are equally important - new guests and clanguests.

In the end, if we have an equal amount of nooby and pro maps in the server, whatever map is voted some people might leave.
But that doesnt mean the leave forever. The keyword is, as usual, communication:
If a new map is voted, e.g. a pro map, and there are a lot of new players who dont want to play that map, tell them that after this map there will be an easy one. Or tell them hey, lets all gather sunday around lunchtime and jump together so you can learn trickjumping (i guess i should attend those lessons too )
Vice versa, if a noobmap is voted and pros want to leave - they will come back for sure. Especially if you tell them that a pro-map will come later.

And if after all that you still are not okay, we could ofc also try to find a "rule" for it. Example: Whenever a map with a certain level of difficulty is voted, the next map has to be another difficulty. (Like, a noob map is voted --> next map is a pro map).
However, that would mean we have to classify all the maps in hard/easy and also find a way to prevent people from just voting another easy/hard map again after one map ends.

Mimus

Mimus, I agree with you. Only thing that we should mention is the hard or easy maps. As I said we can't really effect it that much. Basicly every time, the outnumbered players (pros or new players) will win. We use random map vote a lot so we can't predict when it will be hard or easy. And you can't really define what is hard and easy (some find ice jumps hard and meanwhile some find over bounce jumps hard). So let's not argue about it and let players decide what they want to play. Even it they leave the server, they will return if they liked it. So we can only make our server friendly and make players want to return and it will be okay.

[Mimus]

A sideways question btw (and still on-topic) why do TJ maps have such a huge timer? like 500 mins. If maps would only be like 30min or sth it would be way more probable that even ppl stay in the server who dislike the current map because they wait for the next.

[Ramneli]

Hello my fellow trickjumpers,

My opinion is that we don't need to add particulary 'beginner', 'medium' nor 'hard' trickjump maps. We have plenty of different maps for different skill levels, but what we should focus on is adding maps that are compatible for every skill level.

Also we could get rid of some unpopular maps to make room for maps that suit every invidual with their stage of progress.

That is what i think about this situation.

[[UJE]Killerspace]

It varies on the map mimus. Each map is different in length people can't finish most maps in 30 mins..

[Poseidon]

As some of you already mentioned, 500 minutes is way too much. Killerspace, if you say that most maps can not be finished within 30 minutes then we should give each map a certain amount of time. So some maps could take a bit longer but seriously, who is playing for 500 minutes on one map? It is important to reduce the time given.

[Bread]

Mimus, that's irrelevant I'm afraid.

Maps on ETJump have no timer due to the mod.

[Strax]

About the timer, I strongly disagree. In worst case (if you want to do someting about it really badly) you should costumize random map vote. With costumize, I mean to put "easy" maps together and "hard" together. Than it would choose 1 from easy and 1 from hard (everytime that vote passes). Now you are thinking, that this isn't even random anymore right? So like I've said it chooses 1 from hard and next time 1 from easy. Now when it takes 1 from hard maps - it goes randomly (it can be any map under hard difficulty), and next time 1 from easy (same for hard, just for easy difficulty maps). I don't know if it is possible to do, but it would be a good solution I think.